Talking About Electricity

The blogger’s note: An email is circulated among the e-buddies on the subject of “Electricity Passing Through Camera’s Flashlight” and that is followed by some interesting exchange of emails between the Great Sifu Dr. JB Lim and Electrical Engineer Ir. Jason Gan. The blogger wishes to share their discussions with the readers.

Can ELECTRICITY pass through flashlight of the digital camera to your body???   Yes it is 100% true!

This is a true incidence reported of a boy aged 19, who was studying in 1st year of engineering, who died in Keshvani Hospital, Mumbai. He was admitted in the Hospital as a burned patient. Reason ??????

This boy had gone to Amravati (a place located in State of Maharashtra) on a study tour, on their return they were waiting at the railway station to catch the train. Many of them started taking pictures of their friends using "Mobile Phones" and / or "Digital Camera". One of them complained that, he was unable to capture the full group of friends in one frame in the Digicam.

This boy moved away to a distance to get the whole group.

He failed to notice that at an angle above his head, 40,000 volts electrical line was passing through.

As soon as he clicked the digital camera, 40,000 volt current passed through the camera flashlight to his camera and then from his camera to his fingers & to his body. All this happened within a fraction of a second. His body was half burned.

They arranged for an ambulance & his burned body was brought to Keshavani Hospital, Mumbai.

For one & half days or so he was conscious & talking. Doctors did not have many hopes as there were a lot of complex issues in his body. He passed away later.

Now how many of us are aware about these technical threats & dangers? Even if we are, how many of us are adhering??

* Please avoid mobile phones on petrol outlets.

* Please avoid talking on mobile phones while driving.

* Change that "Chalta Hai Yaar Attitude".
* Please avoid talking on mobile phones while kept in charging mode without disconnecting from wall socket.

* Please do not keep mobile phones on your bed while charging and / on wooden furniture.

* Avoid using mobile phones / Digital cameras near high voltage electrical lines like in railway stations and avoid using flash.

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Dr JB Lim’s comments:

From: lim juboo

Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2013 5:56 PM

Dear Electrical Engineer Jason Gan,

Over to you for your expert comment and opinion.

In my opinion the flash from a digital camera is just ordinary light discharged from a transformer that steps up a 230-voltage current from the capacitor to between 1,000 and 4,000 volts onto a metal plate next to the flash to ionize the xenon gas into a brilliant plasma of light in the camera flash tube. The flash lights up to synchronize with the shutter opening.

The flash is completely enclosed inside a glass tube which is completely NOT a conductor to electricity like porcelain, cement, rubber, plastic and dry wood. No electricity can enter these materials. The camera flash is NOT a lightning rod. There is nothing there in the flash that is cable of attracting electricity from outside. Electricity to my mind, can only flow along a closed circuit within the flash ONLY.

Neither are light, and sound conductors of electricity unlike copper, metals, and electrolytes (salts, minerals and mineral acids) in water, and they cannot attract electricity if they are far, far away from a source of electricity, except an occasional bolt of lightning.

The ionized plasma is all enclosed in a non-conductive glass tube inside the camera flash which neither allows the ionized gas to escape to react with any electricity outside, nor does it allow any electricity from outside to surge into the flash tube to energize the plasma into higher incandescence.

In physics, a plasma is just a luminous blob of highly ionized gas due to an electrical discharge which may either be extremely hot, or very cold, examples: the plasma of the sun, a plasma from a nuclear explosion, lightning discharges through the air (all searing hot plasma), or cold plasma lights like the northern lights, cold lights from fluorescence tubes and bulbs, plasma lamps, neon lights, fire balls, light emitting plasma, light emitting electronic devices etc. etc.

To my BOGUS simple Form 6 knowledge in physics acquired in the 1960's, if overhead high tension transmission lines can surge into plasma devices like camera flash, then logic tells me, any house built below the high tension wire will also have high voltage electricity both from the transmission lines, as well lightening strike surge into their homes the very instant they switch on any of their plasma devices such as their LCD or plasma TV, or their fluorescence lights. Has it ever happened in the entire history of electricity since its discovery by Benjamin Franklin, or much, much earlier by the ancient Greeks, or has it happened before when plasma TV or neon lights and fluorescence tubes and bulbs was invented? Has high tension electricity from transmission lines ever "electrocuted" all flash lights and plasma emitting devices? Any one with a sound mind can answer that?

Does that argument sound scientifically logical? To my simple Form 6 knowledge in electricity and physics, electricity generates plasma, but not the other way round. Neither does plasma alone (example from a camera flash) attract high tension electricity.

As I said, I am only a BOGUS "electrician" with just a simple Form 6 knowledge on electricity to give you this argument. But it is sufficient for me to write this essay of simple logic. I am not an electrical or electronic engineer.

So I leave you as an electrical engineer to give us a much, much more advanced explanation. Don't worry I think I can digest whatever explanation you have to offer us. I shall listen, maybe smile a bit!

Thanks for your expert explanation

A BOGUS.

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Reply from Ir Jason Gan:

On Tue, May 21, 2013 at 6:32 PM, Gan, Jason wrote:

Dear JB Lim,

Thank you for your accolade of my view in Electricity but I am only sharing my experience. I am sure during our student day where we first gain knowledge on electricity is still with most of us as it is our everyday usage in our life. Before I try to explain the strange behavior of electricity I am sure all of you are aware of “Induce current and Induce voltage” without having direct contact with the source of the Electricity.

High current (Low voltage cables) indices current if we have cables close to a cables having high current flowing through. This is due to the magnet field due to electrical current flow through. That is why we separate the control cables from the power cables. At time we also use the armor (Steel Wire) round the power cables to earth the amour at both ends creating an earthing (grounding) shield around it. For sensitive signal carrying control cables we used screen cables to prevent interference caused by induce voltage or current. Induce voltage is caused by very high voltage. In our earlier television set we have coil around the back of the picture tube. The voltage is about 1000 volts and if you use a test pen to move toward the surrounding of this coil you will see the test pen light up without touch or connecting to any parts of the coil or tube and this we called induce voltage. If we use a thermal scan we can see the electrical energy round the current carrying cables while for high voltage (above 11KV) the energy will be floating around the source of the energy which is the wire/cables waiting to discharge to ground. The High voltage Transmission line are so design that it is sufficient clearance from lines(wire) to ground using air as insulation. In case of underground High voltage cables it is buried in the ground and has cable insulation such as XLPE which will not have much impact in the surrounding areas.

Having stated the above, I will now try to explain that the camera flash or Hand phone signal causes the voltage discharge near high voltage lines in particular near the railway power lines. All high voltage line will have electrical charge floating along the line just like atmospheric electrical charge (Lightning) looking for shortest points to discharge the energy and if you happen to flash your camera at the same time where the electrical charges is nearest to the point of discharge, the camera flashing light disturb the air insulation making a path for the energy discharge occurs. It is not the camera light that attaches the electricity but the discharge of the floating energy due to changes in air insulation. Similarly the hand phone signal also create path for energy discharge.

In Malaysia there is a requirement that no houses is allow under the high voltage transmission lines and must at least 15 meters (if My memory did not fail me) from the center of the transmission line. It is very dangerous to go under a transmission line during a raining season as the insulation level for air will be greatly reduce and this also happens during a bush fire. This is one reason that transmission lines have one additional facility to “Auto re-close” the breaker in event of tripping due to momentary earth fault due to rain or bush fire. It is also mandatory for all technicians working in 500KV outdoor substation to wear protective clothing against induce voltage. I hope I have answered your points raised.

Thank you.

Regards,

Jason Gan

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Dr JB Lim further responded as follows:

From: lim juboo

Sent: Tuesday, May 21, 2013 10:06 PM

Dear Learned Ir. Jason,

Thanks for your elaborate explanation. Now I need to take up a post-retirement course on electricity to understand this stuff called "floating energy" (never heard of it).

But I still cannot understand how this 'floating energy' can enter the glass tube of the camera flash which is well insulated as we all know glass is non-conductor of electricity.

My simple knowledge on electricity and physics from BP High School and English College tells me the flow of electricity is exactly like the flow of water, namely, both will take the path of the least resistance. In this case the transmission wires are the best and easiest path for the electricity to take the copper wires or other metals are the best conductor offering the least resistance.

Lightning in millions of volts can pass through great distance in the air into earth even though there is no wire connecting the sky and the earth. Therefore, lightning has no choice but make use of moist air and water (in the rain) as this offers the next best conductor as the least resistance.

Thus electricity is able to surge through the rain clouds using rain, water and moist air as the best next conductor (I think so?).

But in our case, the transmission wires are there, and any 'floating energy' should remain floating around the wires instead of passing through tens of metres of air (not a very good conductor if not moist) into the camera flash only to be blocked by a glass casing of the flash. The electrical discharge from the camera flash cannot get out to interact with any electricity outside, neither can any electricity from outside enter because of the insulation by glass. Isn't that electrically logical (my thinking).

In any case, your explanation is very interesting as you are an expert on electricity, and I am not.

I only have a simple knowledge on electricity and magnetism from what I studied in Form 5 and 6 half a century ago. It tells me, when a current flows through a wire, a magnetic field (line of flux) is generated around the wire and we can even predict the direction of field using the corkscrew or right-hand thumb rule or the left hand Fleming's rule if we know the direction of the flow of electricity.

That is the only "floating energy" I know from my simple knowledge. But this floating energy to my simple understanding is not electricity, but just a magnetic field unless you cut the magnetic flux using coiled wires (solenoid).

In that case you can induce electricity inside the solenoid as in a dynamo. Of course is the only my BOGUS knowledge I learn over half a century ago. Thankfully I still remember them and have not suffered from old age dementia or Alzheimer disease yet (hopefully not).

Maybe your explanation about 'floating energy' around the wires is this same magnetism I have in mind (not sure what you have in mind?) If this is the case, what I need to know now is how does this floating magnetism suddenly become electricity without being induced mechanically by a dynamo. A dynamo works by converting its rotational mechanical energy into electricity by cutting through a magnetic field - sorry if my Form 5 knowledge fails me)

But how is it possible to change an energy field in the air into electricity and send it down into a small flash device? This, I just cannot figure out? That's why I need to take up a short refreshers course on electricity and magnetism to understand. But such courses will still make me a BOGUS electrical engineer or a BOGUS electrician even more if I hang these certificates on the wall. I am already BOGUS enough trying to figure things out at school physics level.

Anyway, a thousand thanks for your expert explanation. At least I now learn something about "floating energy" in high tension wires.

By the way in lighter vein, do my household wires contain any 'floating electricity' that floats around my house? Don't I get electrocuted by "electrified air" (don't know what this is?) just by innocently sitting around my house watching TV without touching any wires?

If there is any leakage floating around, this explains why my electricity bill was higher than I actually use. It must have leaked into the air and cause wastage.

Initially I thought my neighbour stole my electricity using some concealed wires connected to my meter.

Now I want to know how do I channel that ‘floating electricity’ from my neighbour’s house into my house to drive my electrical appliances? Do I need a camera flash or use my mobile phone? There must be a way to steal electricity from the air without making it so obvious using wires.

As a learned electrical engineer you can give us some tips how do we do this to reduce our electricity bills. It would be a great and very innovative invention that deserves triple GOLD MEDALS in ITEX. I shall award them to you as I have been an International ITEX Judge every year over the last nearly 20 years.

Thanks a lot for your learned and expert professional explanation

(Just a simple student wondering about electricity)

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Reply from Ir Jason Gan:

Wednesday, 22 May, 2013 8:48 AM

From: "Gan, Jason"

Dear Dr. JB Lim,

Maybe I am not clear in my explanation and please don’t put me too high up on the pedestal as I am just sharing my thoughts and experience in my line of work. You are right that electricity does not penetrate the glass but due to the force of discharge to ground the glasses are broken and we assume that the electrical discharge when through the glasses. In most electrical accident it is difficult to determine the actual causes but just probable causes as the after effect are all carbon or burnt out.

If you use a Thermal Scanner on the high voltage transmission line you will observe that the electrical energy is floating (Better words is tracking around the line) around the lines. This is due to the fact that air contain particles which maybe conductive. Say if you are under a high voltage Railway lines where the medium of insulation is air, your body will induce a certain amount of voltage and the clearance between ground and the high voltage is reduces by your height. So the camera flash will disturb the air insulation any might created a concentration of conductive particulars between your body and the line reduce further the air insulation to a level where electrical discharge occurs (just like lightning) through your body in the process broken your camera lens/flash glass.

Just for information, we used the Thermal Scanner to determine the “Hot Spot” on the transmission line to determine the like faults on the line.

I hope the above clear some doubt in your mind. Thank you

Regards,

Jason

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Reproduced below the request from the blogger for permission to post and the replies:

From: Tai Onn Lau

Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2013 11:41 AM

To: lim juboo; Gan, Jason

Dear Great Sifu Dr JB Lim and Ir. Jason Gan,

Thanks a lot to both of you for giving us an interesting and in-depth discussion about Electricity and sharing your insight on the relevant subject of Physics which some of us, me in particular, have already returned to our Form 5 and 6 teachers by now. LOL!

.

May I request your permission to allow me to 'publish' your emails into my 'FOOD FOR THOUGHT' blog so as to share with my readers?

Thank you once again.

.

Regards,

Lau

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First reply:

On Wed, May 22, 2013 at 1:13 PM, Gan, Jason wrote:

Dear Master Sifu Lay (sic),

No problem on my side. Thank you

Regards,

Jason

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Second reply:

.

Wednesday, 22 May, 2013 6:22 PM

From: lim juboo

Dear Great Grand Sifu TO,

Do anything you like so long as you don't get electrocuted by lightning strike, and "floating electricity" inside your house.

But don't worry, as long as you can rely on my bogus knowledge on electricity studied half a century ago, I suggest you wrap up your entire house in Kajang with mosquito wire netting so that neither mosquitoes nor insects can get inside your house, nor lightening can get in.

You will be safe inside ‘cos I heard that lightning is very fond of blasting Kajang every time there is a thunderstorm.

Not only that, all the free excess energy from TNB floating around the wires in the ceiling of your house also cannot get out your wire-caged house.

You can now make use of that free "wireless electricity in the air" to drive all your household appliances because it comes in wireless without any subscription, and is not connected to your electric meter. That way you need not pay electricity bill. Just get them wireless floating outside the wire, from the air, or from the transmission power lines in Kajang. Each time you pass through this transmission line which is very prominent along the railway track in Kajang, remember me how to trap free floating electricity.

What I am trying to tell you Great Grand Sifu is, with my bogus ideas and invention, you can now get free wireless electricity connection without any subscription, and at the same time safe from mosquitoes and lightning strike in your house by living inside this Faraday Cage, an electric proof cage made of conducting materials I learn inside my ancient and out-of-date Form 5 General Science text book in Dr Chua Soi Lek and Chief Minister Lim Guan Eng Batu Pahat High School.

Unfortunately, this Faraday Cage has also caged me in along with my memories about school physics, electricity, magnetism and electric circuits inside my brain until now I too cannot get out to think critically "outside the box" unlike CSL and LGE who are thinking and fighting outside the cage all the time.

At last, I am just a Life-long Prisoner living inside this Faraday Cage.

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P/s:  The blogger feels so shy and embarrassed for being called ‘Great Grand Sifu’ by the genuine Great Sifu Dr JB Lim who is apparently ‘retaliating’ against the blogger for constantly and consistently addressing him as the Great Sifu. What to do as he refuses to listen to the blogger’s appeal not to be called ‘Sifu’ at all?
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It must be stressed that while Dr JB Lim is a genuine Great Sifu, the blogger is genuinely a BOGUS ‘Sifu’. LOL!